Any interest in Keyshawn Johnson?

[Fanman]

He was released by Carolina yesterday....just curious if anyone thinks he might be a good fit here. Would he be a better fit than Mason for a possession type WR?

FM

[RavensInBrazil]

If I could replace Mason for Keyshawn for free, I would, but as it is it's totally not worth it. He's a good receiver, but he's too digruntled and selfish, and I think we don't need any help at WR for now, especially at the price he's likely to command

[Ravenswarrior19]

The thing with Mason is, he and Clayton seem like exact clones of each other. Both about the same height/weight, good hand, able to find soft spots in zones. If there is a particular route we want run, we usually choose to run it for Clayton because there is a better chance with his quickness to break it for a big gain. Thereby, Clayton gets more balls and Mason complains.

I would rather have Keyshawn than Mason, just because he's tall and would add variety to the offense. But factoring in his asking price (assuming high) and his mouth (locker room chemistry) I'll stick with Mason.

I love Mason for 2 reasons.
1. Earned my respect playing his heart out in our wars with the Titans.
2. Still enamored with any Raven's reciever who can catch on 3rd down, and he was the first. 15 yard square in anyone?

[RavenFanatic2k6]

I would rather have him than Mason, but I would be suprised if the FO has any interest.

Wouldn't want them both. Johnson isn't going to go anywhere he won't be starting, and having him and Mason starting would stunt the development of Clayton, as well as make Williams role in the offense almost non-existent. If the Ravens believe Clayton and Williams will be their premier WRs as soon as 2008, that can't happen.

[Fanman]

The more I think about Johnson the more intriguing it becomes. He is bigger than Mason and can actually break a tackle once in a while. Plus w/ his size w/ him on the field w/ DW, there will be a mismatch on some DB. I agree, no way we could have both, but I am not a Mason fan.

Yes KJ has a mouth, but he is pretty fearless over the middle and known to be a very good blocker too. But I am sure the cost it too high.

Oh well....just thinking out loud.

FM

[highwater]

Keyshawn Johnson? Just . . . say . . . NO!

For once, we are pretty set at WR. Mason may have acted like a bit of a prick toward the end of last season, but he's a Jimmy Stewart good-guy character compared to Keyshawn. We don't need him -- no, no, no.

[Sports Steve]

No please no too much trouble. He's lost a lot anyway


:jester: :jester:

[TL24x7]

You have to wonder why the WR needy Panthers would get rid of KJ. It certainly raises suspicions. If you watched him on ESPN's draft coverage, you may have heard him for all intents and purposes throw any Carolina receiver not named Keyshawn or Steve Smith under the bus.

Do we want that potential distraction?

Also consider that to cut Derrick Mason, it would cost the Ravens $4.2 million in cap money. If he stays, his cap number is 4.4 million. If Mason were to go and KJ were to come, he would at the very, very, very least want $1million. So couple that with Mason's cap number if cut of 4.2 and now you are at $5.2. Not a good move for a team looking to preserve cap space in order to extend Terrell Suggs.

He doesn't have that rapport with McNair and he doesn't know that Ravens' system.

I vote pass....

[RavensDomination]

You have to wonder why the WR needy Panthers would get rid of KJ. It certainly raises suspicions. If you watched him on ESPN's draft coverage, you may have heard him for all intents and purposes throw any Carolina receiver not named Keyshawn or Steve Smith under the bus.

Do we want that potential distraction?

Also consider that to cut Derrick Mason, it would cost the Ravens $4.2 million in cap money. If he stays, his cap number is 4.4 million. If Mason were to go and KJ were to come, he would at the very, very, very least want $1million. So couple that with Mason's cap number if cut of 4.2 and now you are at $5.2. Not a good move for a team looking to preserve cap space in order to extend Terrell Suggs.

He doesn't have that rapport with McNair and he doesn't know that Ravens' system.

I vote pass....

Yea, I was for it before I read this but you convinced me. If ditching Mason were more cap friendly I would definitely do it, but we still have to do the Suggs deal and KJ would want more than league min. so I'd have to vote pass too. It's still intriguing to think about a big, reliable possession receiver to compliment Clayton.

[psuasskicker]

At the right price I'd take him, but it'd have to be super cheap.

We just don't need him, though. Mason, Clayton, DWill, Heap, plus Figurs and Moore will find their places in the lineup too. Plus, he'd only be around for a year or two before retiring.

- C -

[Ravens0587]

If you watched him on ESPN's draft coverage, you may have heard him for all intents and purposes throw any Carolina receiver not named Keyshawn or Steve Smith under the bus.

For all intents and purposes up until the draft any Carolina WR not named Keyshawn or Steve Smith wasn't very good. That's why they brought keyshawn in in the first place. That is also why they drafted Jarret.

[TL24x7]

For all intents and purposes up until the draft any Carolina WR not named Keyshawn or Steve Smith wasn't very good. That's why they brought keyshawn in in the first place. That is also why they drafted Jarret.

So then why was he cut? Doesn't that move weaken their receiving corps on a whole? Could a rookie drafted in round 2 replace KJ's production immediately? There's a reason a team with needs at WR cut KJ and IMO that screams, "Steer clear!"

[Fanman]

couldn't Carolina cutting KJ be compared to the Ravens letting go Mulitalo..a move to get a little younger?

FM

[jonboy79]

couldn't Carolina cutting KJ be compared to the Ravens letting go Mulitalo..a move to get a little younger?

FM


The difference I see is that Mule will have a VERY hard time finding a starting job in the future, Keyshawn will likely start on any tema he goes to. Keyshawn appears to be in the October/November of his career, while for Mule it appears way into December. I think he will provide some veteran depth and leadership for a year in Detroit then call it a career.

[TL24x7]

couldn't Carolina cutting KJ be compared to the Ravens letting go Mulitalo..a move to get a little younger?

FM

I don't even think those situations are remotely parallel....

The Ravens have better players ready to step in for Edwin and Edwin has forgotten more about being a great team guy than KJ will ever know. Does Carolina have better WR's than KJ ready to step up? I don't think so. Not yet anyway and they are viewed as a potential playoff team...

[ExiledRaven]

Gotta love the NFC, right Tony? :rolling:

[GreenWave52]

Wow talk about some "the neighbors grass is always greener-itis" going on in this thread. Key is done. He is slower than Todd Heap. Mason, Clayton, and DWill all have great hands so we don't need a posession guy.

Just because Mason got frustrated doesn't mean we have to cut him. He is still the #1 receiver on this team (although Clayton will probably pass him this season).

[Fanman]

man TL...what did KJ do to you? Let's see who puts up better numbers this year...if both stay healthy.

Career stats: ==========G / Rec / Yds / Avg / TD

Johnson (1996-2006):===167 / 814 / 10571 / 13.0 / 64
Average year:=========15.2 / 74 / 961 / 13.0 / 5.8

Mason (1997-2006)=====154 / 607 / 7937 / 13.1 / 42
Average year:=========15.4 / 60.7 / 793.7 / 13.1 / 4.2

FM

[jonboy79]

Or we can compare last year's stats. Keyshawn was his team's #2, Mason our #1...
KJ- 70 rec, 815 yards, 4TDs
Mase- 68 rec, 750yds, 2tds

Now I'm not saying that we should make a move, but I really don't understand why Carolina did, or didn't even try and trade for any value... He is still a productive pro.

[TL24x7]

FM, you can't live in the past. Career stats are no indication of what a receiver will do going forward. And you can't discount the money issue. I'll take Mason and the extra money to give to Suggs than a malcontent who isn't even wanted by a team that needs receivers. While I would admit the Ravens could use depth at the position, GreenWave nailed it when he said the Ravens already have players that can do what KJ can do -- and probably do it better particularly at this point in his career.

[ExiledRaven]

doesn't really make sense to add Key, I am with Tony...both from a money perspective and from the fact that the team desperately needs to give D. Williams a chance to progress.


As for mason, depending on what happens, he could well be the defacto #3 guy at the end of the year if Williams progresses.

Comparing numbers between Chad Johnson, TO, and Williams, he seems to be in very nice company for a first year....though at the some point our boy C. Moore seems to have decent stats too.

I've thrown in a mess of guys to compare 1st seasons....and dear lord look at Moss' 1st season in MN. Wow.


C Yds YPC Long TD 20+ 40+ 1st down
Williams: 22 396 18.0 77 2 9 1 18
Johnson: 28 329 11.8 28 1 3 0 22
T. Ownes: 35 520 14.9 46 4 7 2 23
C. Moore: 24 293 12.2 52 4 2 1 18
Clayton: 44 471 10.7 47 2 3 1 24
Harrison: 64 836 13.1 41 8 15 1 43
Wayne: 27 345 12.8 43 0 6 1 19
R. Moss: 69 1313 19.0 61 17 20 14 51
Fitzgerald: 58 780 13.4 48 8 15 1 36
Boldin: 101 1377 13.6 71 8 20 6 62


Yes, the numbers are all over, but Williams really has a nose for explosive plays. Only Moss had a higher average per catch.

If the team can get Williams on the field, the sky could be the limit. I am very high on his potential at the moment, hopefully the team will let him prove that.

Unfortunately, this experience will further diminish Mason's role on the offense...making him a 3rd or 4th target or a short yardage receiver due to his experience.

[Fanman]

I get all the salary cap stuff...and by NO means would I sign KJ at the expense of signing Suggs. It's just this is an odd case where a team outright releases an above avg WR. Mouth or no mouth we made an offer to Terrel Owens...the biggest jerk in the NFL.

And IMO Mason has underperformed since he got here. He is a #1 WR in his mind only. I don't really care if we sign him or not...I just like the debate.

FM

[otherside_of_tracks]

(although Clayton will probably pass him this season).
the him is Mason


I Have to go with you on that one. Mark has come in and done as much as he can, and you can tell from the way he plays. Great Player and i hope he's with the team for a long time. Start looking for Clayton getting more passes this year.