Keep your heads up, there is some hope now

[ClericBlackDave]

I posted this on scout, and I'll say it here. We all gotta have some hope here. It seems that the end of our Geriatric Senior QB experiment has come.


Here's where we have some hope: if we can beat the browns at home, San Diego is a very vulnerable team if we can stop LT (which we did last year).


If you didn't hear, Dwight Freeney might be out for season, and is at least out for our game. Likewise, it looks like they are HURT at WR with gonzales and harrison nicked up, and Aaron Moorehead is a bum and Reggie Wayne is SOFT (doesn't attack the ball)


If we can get back C-Mac and/or Samari Rolle we might have a chance.


I have the patriots game as a loss, obviously.


What it comes down to is, does Boller give us any spark?


To me, just seeing him look downfield to connect with Mark Clayton (he exists again?) is a plus. I think there's some hope.


He's to being optimistic for a 9-7 season.

[Tspot-D-Ravenator]

I posted this on scout, and I'll say it here. We all gotta have some hope here. It seems that the end of our Geriatric Senior QB experiment has come.


Here's where we have some hope: if we can beat the browns at home, San Diego is a very vulnerable team if we can stop LT (which we did last year).


If you didn't hear, Dwight Freeney might be out for season, and is at least out for our game. Likewise, it looks like they are HURT at WR with gonzales and harrison nicked up, and Aaron Moorehead is a bum and Reggie Wayne is SOFT (doesn't attack the ball)


If we can get back C-Mac and/or Samari Rolle we might have a chance.


I have the patriots game as a loss, obviously.


What it comes down to is, does Boller give us any spark?


To me, just seeing him look downfield to connect with Mark Clayton (he exists again?) is a plus. I think there's some hope.


He's to being optimistic for a 9-7 season.
I am endlessly optimistic Dave...I think Brian Billick can take them on a 7 game winning streak...He did it last year, he's can do it again! I like your attitude bro!:thumbup:

[Mista T]

We are at the 9 game point of the season and it looks hopeless...... Don't forget what happened after the ninth game of the 2000 season. We were commiserating at the postgame tailgate party about Billick's offensive ineptitude 5 game TD-less streak and hoping for a miracle turnaround .... then came the 12 game win streak and Lombardi Trophy.

[Galen Sevinne]

I posted this on scout, and I'll say it here. We all gotta have some hope here. It seems that the end of our Geriatric Senior QB experiment has come.


Here's where we have some hope: if we can beat the browns at home, San Diego is a very vulnerable team if we can stop LT (which we did last year).


If you didn't hear, Dwight Freeney might be out for season, and is at least out for our game. Likewise, it looks like they are HURT at WR with gonzales and harrison nicked up, and Aaron Moorehead is a bum and Reggie Wayne is SOFT (doesn't attack the ball)


If we can get back C-Mac and/or Samari Rolle we might have a chance.


I have the patriots game as a loss, obviously.


What it comes down to is, does Boller give us any spark?


To me, just seeing him look downfield to connect with Mark Clayton (he exists again?) is a plus. I think there's some hope.


He's to being optimistic for a 9-7 season.

Danger! Danger! Will Robinson

[purplepoe]

I'll take that "soft" WR any day of the week.

PP

[ClericBlackDave]

I'll take that "soft" WR any day of the week.

PP


Did you watch that Colts game? He doesn't attack the ball. He just waits for it to come to him. That works when Manning is on, but with their starting LT out and Manning under pressure, the acuracy diminishes and Reggie Wayne isn't the type to bail him out.


Also, looks like Dwight Freeney is out for the YEAR


Honestly, I think we have a chance. Boller has to want to play well and create some sort of niche for him, as a starter or backup.


Mark Clayton seems to be getting healthy.


I like our chances if we can just beat the Browns. With the way Derek Anderson and that offense is playing, i think they're a tougher matchup than Indy or SD. Go ahead and hate on me, but we can stop the run. its the pass that kills us, and Peyton is looking innacurate under pressure (as usual) and Phillips Rivers is Phillips river. Doesn't scare me.


I have hope.

[Ravenator]

Look, to be honest I won't give up on this team ever but to be realistic we will finish 9-7 at best and probably 8-8. But you know, if Boller goes 4-3 over the final 7 then hell he should be named starting QB for week one next year right away.

[Ravenswarrior19]

I love the optimism. I'll hold out hope. But does Boller ever win on the road?
9-7 sounds cool, but not with our Division/Conference record. 10-6 is the magic number. Its gonna take a lotta hoping.

[ClericBlackDave]

I love the optimism. I'll hold out hope. But does Boller ever win on the road?
9-7 sounds cool, but not with our Division/Conference record. 10-6 is the magic number. Its gonna take a lotta hoping.


I understand skepticism about Boller on the road. But think about his recent road history. Not great, but not abysmal

1) this year against the Bills, within 1 TD of winning, had 2nd and 1, and Billick calls 2 passes with our o-line playing like shit.

2) 2005 browns game. Threw a TD to Mark Clayton that would have locked up the game except everyone's favorite man Jonathan Ogden was illegally downfield.


Also, the chargers are the AFC team we're playing on the road, and they just almost choked up a win against the colts where they scored 1 offensive TD and 2 on special teams. I don't fear them.


I'd be worried about the Seahawks, but they play in the NFC. Nuff said.


If we lose to New England, but win out, that 10-6 with a good 2nd half streak and momentum going into the playoffs.


I'm not saying its LIKELY, i'm saying I have hope. Unlike McNair, for Boller Baltimore will be his legacy. He has all the motivation to make this happens, and the tools to do so. Billick just needs to let him win or lose the games for us.


BTW, I still think Boller could have won us the Colts game last year and should have gotten the 2nd half. His home record is impressive. But thats just me.

[Ravenswarrior19]

Well, I just checked the frig... There is a small cup of purple kool-aid left over from training camp. Might as well have at it!

[Jggjaron]

I have never stopped hoping and keep the fact in mind that the ravens can overcome the odd, We were injured a lot in the first half of the season we are just getting healthy now for the second half. I will keep on rooting for this team and always look at the positives and not the negatives that Everyone else on hear seems to like pointing out.

Just like mother said if you don't have anything nice to say don't say anything at all.

[Raveninwoodlawn]

Never say never...that's why I watch every game...even games I feel confident that we will lose.

BTW...I too would take Reggie Wayne over any of our WR's any day of the week.

[ClericBlackDave]

Never say never...that's why I watch every game...even games I feel confident that we will lose.

BTW...I too would take Reggie Wayne over any of our WR's any day of the week.


For route running, separation, and hands, I'd take Reggie Wayne.


For toughness, ability to adjust to poorly thrown balls, and ability to BAIL OUT HIS QB, I wouldn't. i.e. HE'S SOFT


How did Manning throw 6 INTs agains the Chargers? He was under pressure (No Tony Ugoh) and his throws were a bit inacurate, but on at least 2 of those 6 Wayne could have gone up and played DB and stopped the INT but he stood there at watched the INT happen.


On most teams, your QB gets pressured and make those kind of throws, and your WR/TE has to bail your QB out. I don't think Wayne is capable and, for this reason, AT HOME, I expect the Ravens to pressure Manning and get their fair share of INTs from him, UNCONTESTED by Wayne/Moorehead/etc


Edit: This is where, while I hate him, Hines Ward is a great WR for adjusting to balls thrown way behind him, etc. To his credit, Mason is also great at doing this.

[Raveninwoodlawn]

I'd think considering his numbers as well as Mannings...and the fact that last year Wayne seemed to take over as Mannings primary WR, Peyton and the Colts feel otherwise.

It's your opinion though and your entitled to it.

[RavensNTerps]

For route running, separation, and hands, I'd take Reggie Wayne.


For toughness, ability to adjust to poorly thrown balls, and ability to BAIL OUT HIS QB, I wouldn't. i.e. HE'S SOFT


How did Manning throw 6 INTs agains the Chargers? He was under pressure (No Tony Ugoh) and his throws were a bit inacurate, but on at least 2 of those 6 Wayne could have gone up and played DB and stopped the INT but he stood there at watched the INT happen.


On most teams, your QB gets pressured and make those kind of throws, and your WR/TE has to bail your QB out. I don't think Wayne is capable and, for this reason, AT HOME, I expect the Ravens to pressure Manning and get their fair share of INTs from him, UNCONTESTED by Wayne/Moorehead/etc


Edit: This is where, while I hate him, Hines Ward is a great WR for adjusting to balls thrown way behind him, etc. To his credit, Mason is also great at doing this.

Wayne still had like 150+ yards....

[purplepoe]

Did you watch that Colts game? He doesn't attack the ball. He just waits for it to come to him. That works when Manning is on, but with their starting LT out and Manning under pressure, the acuracy diminishes and Reggie Wayne isn't the type to bail him out.

Dude, you have got to be kidding me. Yes I watched the Colts/Chargers game and I know exactly which play you are talking about where you are drawing your conclusion. Wayne didn't come back to the ball that Manning threw when he was under duress. Good lord man, the guy took some wicked shots over the middle and held onto the ball. He had 10 receptions for 140 yds and a TD and you're gonna come on here and blast the guy and say he's soft? I just....nevermind.

I understand skepticism about Boller on the road. But think about his recent road history. Not great, but not abysmal

1) this year against the Bills, within 1 TD of winning, had 2nd and 1, and Billick calls 2 passes with our o-line playing like shit.

2) 2005 browns game. Threw a TD to Mark Clayton that would have locked up the game except everyone's favorite man Jonathan Ogden was illegally downfield.


Also, the chargers are the AFC team we're playing on the road, and they just almost choked up a win against the colts where they scored 1 offensive TD and 2 on special teams. I don't fear them.


I'd be worried about the Seahawks, but they play in the NFC. Nuff said.


If we lose to New England, but win out, that 10-6 with a good 2nd half streak and momentum going into the playoffs.


I'm not saying its LIKELY, i'm saying I have hope. Unlike McNair, for Boller Baltimore will be his legacy. He has all the motivation to make this happens, and the tools to do so. Billick just needs to let him win or lose the games for us.


BTW, I still think Boller could have won us the Colts game last year and should have gotten the 2nd half. His home record is impressive. But thats just me.

I understand your hatred for McNair. I understand your undying admiration for Boller. But please join us here in reality, will ya? This team has multiple problems. It isn't just the QB. No matter how much you'd like to believe it is, it's just not.

1. WE LOST THE BILLS GAME WHILE SCORING 14 POINTS. And yes, Billick called 3 straight passing plays that we all didn't understand. But guess what, none of them were completed to convert. Stop it please. If McNair was on the field, would you be saying "within 1 TD of winning"? Good lord.

2. The TD to Clayton would've "locked up" the game? That play was in the FIRST QUARTER Dave. And I love the "everyone's favorite man" dig at Ogden. The Ogden who has played Hall of Fame football for a decade but gets bashed by you on ONE penalty in the FIRST quarter of a game. But anything to protect Boller right? I mean, he only had 3 more quarters and some change to score another TD. Your 2 examples of Boller not being bad on the road involve 2 losses where we scored 16 and 14 points respectively. Stop with the excuses after excuses already. It's nauseating.

3. You don't fear SD after we've lost every road game except the Niners game where the only reason we won that game is because they might be the worst team in the league besides Miami. Not only have we lost those games but we've looked bad doing it. But throwing Boller out there is gonna change all that?

4. You're not worried about the Seahawks because they play in the NFC? This isn't 2003-2006.

5. Who cares where McNair's legacy is? Who cares where Boller's legacy is? You and only you. Everyone else cares about trying to win games. Both McNair and Boller have motivation to win every game they start Dave. Do you think McNair is happy or satisfied with the way this season has gone? He knows his play has been embarrassing and that he's a huge reason this team is 4-5. Your insinuation is clear because you've voiced this same stuff over and over. I've been the biggest Boller critic over the years but never have I questioned his heart or desire to win.

6. We know you think Boller could have won the Colts game last year. But guess what, he didn't play. But yea, Im sure he could've beaten a Super Bowl bound and winning team. Because he's proven that to us as well.:eyes:

It's funny really. Everyone agrees that Boller should be the QB of this team. Most (including me) believe he should've come into the Bengals game at 6-0 or 9-0 with a chance to win the game. Instead of sitting back and seeing what the guy can do, you come on espousing delusions of grandeur without a leg to stand on to back anything up. Why?

Hope and positive thinking is one thing.

Ridiculous hyperbole is another.

McNair is out. Boller is in.

Let's see what he can do and stop projecting beating the defending Super Bowl champs.

How's that sound?

PP

[Raveninwoodlawn]

I wasn't going to post a long response because you never know.

But how I really feel...thanks PP.

I don't give a damn about excuses, win a damn game on teh road.

[festivus]

Great thoughts CBD.

I hope they make the playoffs, I really do. I don't think it's especially likely, but hope springs eternal.

[RavenTD]

Its certainly helps having a short memory during a season like this.
Before each game my memory is erased and I prepare with hope
and joy for a Raven victory.

That lasts until the offense comes out.And the hope starts to sink bit by bit.
As we see the same old,same old, futilty.

I'll be there at the start of every game like Pavlov's dog,expecting to be served a tasty treat.

GO RAVENS

[Greg]

This team is in a hole they put themselves in and the way out of it is to win this week and see how deep you still are. Then win the following week. Then the next.

One game at a time.

[purplepoe]

This team is in a hole they put themselves in and the way out of it is to win this week and see how deep you still are. Then win the following week. Then the next.

One game at a time.

Exactly.

PP

[highwater]

I haven't stopped hoping for improvement, but frankly, if Billick had named McNair the starter for this next game, I would have probably given up. I'm not suggesting Boller is the answer to turning things around, but at least with Boller I have some hope. I wouldn't have with McNair, not after those last two games.

And hopefully CMac will be back for this game too.

[Gwaihir]

They just need to shut C-Mac down for the year. Let him have the surgery. Let's see how good this "young stable of cornerbacks" really is! We need to find out what we have and they didn't look too bad against one of the most explosive receiving corps around in Cincy. I want C-Mac to be totally healthy going into next year!

[4G63]

They just need to shut C-Mac down for the year. Let him have the surgery. Let's see how good this "young stable of cornerbacks" really is! We need to find out what we have and they didn't look too bad against one of the most explosive receiving corps around in Cincy. I want C-Mac to be totally healthy going into next year!

I would have to agree....we are essentially out of right now anyway so lets see what we've got. They looked bad against the Stealers but rebounded well against the Bengals so lets see how they do against a New England and Indy offense....

[RAVENOUS52]

We have a chance, albeit a slim chance...But a chance is all we need.

One day at a time, one offensive series at a time.

[highwater]

We have a chance, albeit a slim chance...But a chance is all we need.

I agree -- it obviously doesn't look promising, but it's not impossible, and shutting down CMac should be a medical decision in any event. If he's cleared to play, and we're not totally out of it, why not let him play?

We will no doubt be underdogs in most of our remaining games, but that doesn't mean we have to lose them.

[ClericBlackDave]

Just seeing Boller hit Clayton deep against the Bengals, only being on the field a total of a few minutes, give me hope.


its something we weren't going to see from McNair this year.


PP, its not a hatred of McNair. It was a realistic view, I had since the middle/end of last season, that McNair was done. It wasn't just last year's Colts games. The games before that, and the games this year . . . the proof was in the pudding. The national media sees it. Fans see it. Don't shoot the messenger.


We would all love to have the Mac-9 under center that beat the Ravens at M&T bank in 2003. The player no longer exists.


And so, starting Boller gives me hope. And if it comes to that, starting Troy Smith give me hope. Starting about anyone besides an over-the-hill McNair gives me hope.


The Chiefs made the playoffs last year. Thats all I need to see to let me have hope.


This team just needs to get hot at the right time.


Its unlikely, but if for ANY REASON the Ravens make the playoffs, we're a dangerous team.


Thinks Pittsburg Steelers of a few years back being the 6th seed after a monster second half and winning the whole thing.


If we can get in, its means we've gotten healthy and explosive at the right time.


I can, and will, be optimistic.

[purplepoe]

PP, its not a hatred of McNair. It was a realistic view, I had since the middle/end of last season, that McNair was done. It wasn't just last year's Colts games. The games before that, and the games this year . . . the proof was in the pudding. The national media sees it. Fans see it. Don't shoot the messenger.

Starting about anyone besides an over-the-hill McNair gives me hope.

Dave. It's almost unanimous that people think Boller should be the starter and should've been playing earlier.

What part of that don't you understand?

You constantly go out of your way take shots at McNair and heap praise on Boller with outlandish takes.

It's in Boller's hands now. Sure, the season might be a lost cause as far as playoffs but Boller playing well for a 7 game span can really help this team as far as the future goes.

You just can resist taking pot shots instead of just focusing on the here and now.

PP

[crazyraven]

You just can resist taking pot shots instead of just focusing on the here and now.
First of all I feel Boller should start. Right now an Injured Mcnair is not doing anyone any good. But if people feel they have to take pot shots at the QB they will. Its expected. You play bad, people will take shots. Its a two way street. You play well and you are celebrated, you play like shit you get booed. Just keep in mind some people have been saying some real bold statements about a guy who hasnt shown us much and when he falls on his face they will do one of two things--either go on a very long sabbatical or continue on with the unfounded support of a QB who has struggled his entire career.

I just find it funny that a boller basher is taking issue with pot shots.

[RavenLisa]

I wish I could feel better about the upcoming Colts game as Dwight Freeney now out for the year. However the Ravens haven't shown any offense. Even with a bad day the Colts can score 15 and I'll offense doesn't. I only hope the play calling changes now. In the past Dwight Freeney out I think we would all be pumped up but we even have to worry about the Browns now.

[ClericBlackDave]

I just find it funny that a boller basher is taking issue with pot shots.

Thank you, Crazy.

As for taking a sabatical, not going to happen. If Boller doesn't do well, I look forward to Troy Smith getting a shot.


PP, I don't think you understand my thing with McNair. Its not taking shots at him, its telling the truth. He's been washed up for the last 8 games or so. It'd be like recognizing that Johnny U was washed up as a Charger. Its not hate, its truth.


I just didn't think the Ravens ship needed to go down with McNair's career.


A few year ago, you and others thought that the Ravens ship didn't need to go down with Boller's career.


The only differences are 1) now the shoe is on the other foot 2) Boller is a young QB (still only 26) who probably needed more time to develop than we gave him.


I look forward to seeing whether his year 1/2 layoff as backup has helped him mature.


And like I said, seeing the deep completions he's had recently to any of our WRs, along with the deep ATTEMPTS PERIOD, gives me hope. More than I've had than with McNair since the 2nd half of last year.

[purplepoe]

Thank you, Crazy.

PP, I don't think you understand my thing with McNair. Its not taking shots at him, its telling the truth. He's been washed up for the last 8 games or so. It'd be like recognizing that Johnny U was washed up as a Charger. Its not hate, its truth.

Wait one second. I bashed Boller's play. I never questioned the guy's heart or desire to win.

Dave, you have posted numerous times about McNair's heart and that he's really a Titan etc......

Bashing a guy for his play (i.e. Boller for me) is expected.

I absolutely understand "your thing" with McNair. You whined from the beginning about him and you know damn well you took countless shots about more than just his play on the field.

You can pretend you didn't but I sat here and read it over and over myself.

While there are many things that are different between Boller and McNair (age, arm strength, style) there is one thing they both share. Heart and desire.

I'd love nothing more than Boller to succeed. I've said as much countless times on this board. That happening would solve a huge problem for this team. I fully admit I am skeptical but there is no other option now. Give him the ball for 7 games and see what he can do.

PP

[crazyraven]

I bashed Boller's play. I never questioned the guy's heart or desire to win.
CBD didnt question Mcnairs desire or heart either. He Bashed Mcnair, cause he has it coming to him. It sucks that CBD can say these things about Mcnair especially when we are all ravens fans and all hope for the best but right now, he's on the money about him.

[ClericBlackDave]

CBD didnt question Mcnairs desire or heart either. He Bashed Mcnair, cause he has it coming to him. It sucks that CBD can say these things about Mcnair especially when we are all ravens fans and all hope for the best but right now, he's on the money about him.


Again, let me stress, that after Boller gets his final shot, I'm also totally ok with Troy Smith coming in or a miraculous (unlikely) recovery of Steve McNair.


But essentially, everyone who has been shouting that McNair was fine since his starting downhill 2nd half last year was wrong.


Honestly, I understand defending players against criticism, but they need an excuse thats at least half valid. Maybe last year McNair was worn out, didn't know the system, etc. But this year, there was no excuse.


Anyway, I think there's hope now that we can steal one from the colts at home, the chargers away, and if Boller happens to have another vikings/packers game in him, play the patriots tough.


here we go . . .

[purplepoe]

CBD didnt question Mcnairs desire or heart either. He Bashed Mcnair, cause he has it coming to him. It sucks that CBD can say these things about Mcnair especially when we are all ravens fans and all hope for the best but right now, he's on the money about him.

Yes, he did.

On this thread? No.

But in many others over the past year?

Absolutely.

What are you talking about? We are all (at least 99%) in agreement that McNair has been stunningly putrid this season and his play has been a huge reason why we are sitting here at 4-5.

Dave was certainly the lead in his assessment of McNair.


PP